Morons, Influencers and Shysters, Oh My

As we navigate the treacherous seas of HR, Warren and I can't help but question the absence of compassion in corporate corridors. This episode exposes the hard truths behind the firing of an employee from Kite Baby—a company that prides itself on family values—simply for requesting remote work to care for her adopted micro-preemie. The uproar that followed on TikTok serves as a stark reminder that the face behind the brand isn't always what it seems. We also shine a light on the pulse surveys trend, revealing how these quick-fire employee feedback tools could be the next revolution—or just another fad—in gauging staff contentment.

Now, let's talk optics and interviewing—two things that should go hand in hand but often don't. A poorly handled GoFundMe campaign can cause more than just a PR hiccup; it can lead to a full-blown identity crisis for brands like Kite Baby. Warren and I dissect the aftermath of their mishap, then pivot to the interviewee's perspective. We share candid tales from our own hiring experiences, drawing from the good, the bad, and the cringeworthy to equip you with the insights you need to bring your true self to your next big opportunity.

Concluding with the darker side of HR, we recount Brittany Peach's ice-cold layoff via video call and debate the ethical quagmire of recorded firings. The emergence of 'fake experts' in HR is also on our radar, prompting a call for vigilance in whom we trust for career counsel. And who could forget the time HR pros sampled CBD products on a rooftop? It sure was a memorable (and somewhat foggy) lesson in the unpredictability of our profession. Hang tight until our next episode, where we hope Feathers will be back from the digital warfront to join Warren and me in dissecting more HR conundrums.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:02

Had you actually read the email, you would know that the podcast you are about to listen to could contain explicit language and offensive content. These HR experts' views are not representative of their past, present or future employers. If you have ever heard my manager is unfair to me. I need you to reset my HR portal password. Or can I ride up my employee for crying too much? Welcome to our little safe zone. Welcome to JDDHR.

Speaker 2: 0:50

Welcome to JDDHR, to podcast by two HR professionals who want to help you get through to work day by saying all the things you are thinking, but say them out loud. I'm Warren.

Speaker 3: 1:00

I'm CeCe.

Speaker 2: 1:01

All right Back again and Feathers is being attacked by zombie computers that will not come, that actually they're dead, they won't come back to life, but so hopefully we'll see him in the next episode two more weeks or so. But yeah, we have a really cool episode. We've been sharing show notes today and this week and it's got a good episode for you today. But let everybody know, this episode is brought to you by Halle, the original JDDHR rock star and who support us on Patreon. So thank you very much for your support. If you want to be like Halle, just go to our show notes and you can support us there as well, plus a lot of other interesting things in our show notes. So yay, so how's the last two weeks been for you?

Speaker 3: 1:47

Pretty good. Yeah, you know, just hanging in there, okay.

Speaker 2: 1:51

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:53

We're educating people on what pulse surveys are Okay and just patients hanging on. But you know all good, we're pushing through, we're doing continuous listening now.

Speaker 1: 2:04

So at work for engagement surveys.

Speaker 3: 2:08

So you know, trying to introduce some pulse surveys, not scaring people, it's all good.

Speaker 2: 2:15

I'll have to pick your brain about pulse surveys Is our HRS offers them as part of the service to do them? Yeah, I just don't think our employees are going to be very high on responding, I don't know. Yeah, I would love to try that, but we'll see. So there's been a lot in the HR world of news the last two weeks and you found a couple of really cool stories. I want to start with one of those.

Speaker 3: 2:45

Okay, so the one that has been living a little rent-free in my head since, I read it was. I don't know if you heard about the whole kite baby situation, but I didn't really know. Well, actually I take that back.

Speaker 3: 2:58

The only reason why I know who kite baby is is because of the targeted ads I get on social media but I guess the best way to describe it is they're kind of like a bougie organic baby clothing line and I think what it. So what had happened was an employee of theirs just adopted a baby and this was like a micro-premie, like the baby is in the NICU and will be in the NICU for a very long time, and she had asked if she could work remote, which the NICU, I think, and where the baby is is about six months away. So I think she's in Dallas and it's in El Paso and yeah. So they said no. They said technically she was under the FMLA threshold and she.

Speaker 3: 3:52

They said the best they could do is two weeks and if she can't come back after two weeks then they're gonna terminate her. And she was terminated. And this is a. This is definitely a baby. This is a company that prides itself on being pro baby, pro mom, pro family. So it's crazy.

Speaker 2: 4:11

And another piece I found crazy about this story is everything has played out on TikTok. It started with the fired employee's sister posting something on TikTok and then the employer I don't think the employee herself responded on TikTok but the employer made two apologies, not one, but two apologies. If I'm going to make an apology first, I'm gonna call I don't know the mother's name, I'm gonna call her myself on her cell phone and say, hey, I'm the president, ceo, whatever her title is of, of kite baby and yeah, oh, we need to talk. I'd need to apologize, etc. And then maybe do something on on TikTok and say you know, just let you know, we've resolved this and everybody's happy. But yeah it. I think there were just so many fails in this, this situation. It's, it's crazy, I don't know. Like you said, she was there only less than a year, so FMLA technically doesn't apply.

Speaker 3: 5:14

She was there for seven months, seven months.

Speaker 2: 5:17

It I don't see everywhere I've worked in the past has basically treated people who didn't qualify for FMLA as if they did. I mean, what's what's the harm? Give her up to 12 weeks and I don't know what her position was. Was she a truly mission critical type position that you have to be here at a company, can't go on without you a key personnel, as the FMLA would call them, but I don't get that.

Speaker 3: 5:42

Yeah, so I was trying to figure it out and so here's what I was piecing together through. Everything is this person, her name is Marissa, she worked in the photo, in the photo like studio, so I guess, where they take all the photos and the promotional stuff. So I thought maybe she would have been unable, like her job was it was physically.

Speaker 1: 6:04

They're taking pictures, yeah right.

Speaker 3: 6:07

But then I think in the in the CEO's second apology, she's admitted to making a selfish decision because that job has always been in the office and she couldn't imagine it, she couldn't think of an alternative. So that kind of tells me that, yes, she probably could have if you thought about it.

Speaker 2: 6:30

Yeah, you know, if she's an editor and now if she is the photographer and their set is in the kite baby offices and things like that, okay, I can see that as being partially legit. But you can bring in another photographer. I mean, today, with freaking iPhones, people can take incredible pictures. I'm sure you can find somebody who is even a hobbyist photographer with some real good equipment and in their office that could, you know, make things happen for a few weeks. Well, actually I think this was she was going to be in the NICU for six months. Like I said, it was a micro preemie, but she was going to be there for six months. So there's so many things. In the end of the well, you you could tell more about the first apology that got all the people fired up.

Speaker 2: 7:21

Oh yeah, do you want to?

Speaker 3: 7:22

okay. So it was very clear that it was written by legal or PR and she seemed like she was just reading it like from a piece of paper. It didn't seem sincere. I think people picked up on that real fast. And then the other thing was it was just like a non-apology and she ended with the job will find her a place when she's ready to return to work, and it was like she didn't need your help. When she's ready, she like she needs your help now, like she needs to work remotely and that's what she asked for. So, and also, I don't want to come back to you like when I'm ready to return to work.

Speaker 2: 8:05

Exactly, yeah, and I would bet this lady probably has 10 job offers already right now. Yeah, you want to work from home right now, from the NICU? I've got the job for you and she doesn't need to. And plus, by the time, her attorneys. They didn't do anything illegal, I guess. No, it just looks ugly. The optics are very bad, especially for if you're in this industry. If you were, I don't know made hammers or screwdriver, something like that probably not the same reaction that people get, but when you build a brand around babies and family, it's just yeah, optics that are not good at all.

Speaker 3: 8:44

It doesn't align. And I think the icing on the cake is I don't know if you heard about the GoFundMe, but she has. Marissa the employee got terminated. I think she set up a GoFundMe I want to say it was prior to her being terminated but in either case, it's just for the medical uh, the medical costs for the baby in the NICU and I think she set it at like 50 grand just to see if she could get like some money. And I think the the viral piece of this. She's now at, I think, almost 90 grand because people are just throwing money at her. And the really funny part is, if you look down the donors, it's a lot of kite babies, direct competitors so it's it's, and it's like they're putting their names there.

Speaker 3: 9:31

So it's really funny to see kite babies competitors being like here's you know, two thousand dollars, here's a thousand dollars, like all this kind of stuff, and that, I think, is the funniest piece oh yeah, yeah it's, they'll recover, I'm sure, but it, the optics of it, looked really bad and you're setting the tone for your other employees.

Speaker 2: 9:49

You know, ooh, they did this to her. What are they gonna do to me? And yeah, it's, it's not gonna it's not gonna end well it's just growth, like you said.

Speaker 3: 10:00

It's not illegal. It just doesn't feel good, right it.

Speaker 2: 10:05

Yeah, I'm sure they had other options and hopefully, hopefully, they learned their lesson and the third apology will be a genuine one from oh my gosh CEO just needed to take a break from social media for a second, no more oh, and we were talking offline.

Speaker 2: 10:21

That that's how this kite baby grew from that person's social media. So she knows social media, she knows the ins and outs of it and she knows how much of a bitch it can be. There's a little turn on you in a heartbeat if you, if you do something like that, and I think that she's about to see that. That see that. Sorry, I did not see any of the videos. I just read Suzanne Lucas's article on it and so I just read her quotes on it and her take on it and wow, just just crazy and I will say, before I move on, that this is a company that I think I read it was 30 people large.

Speaker 2: 10:58

It's not a huge company so the FMLA wouldn't even apply there if she was there a year yeah, and also I don't think they have an in-house HR.

Speaker 3: 11:08

It was, the decision was just made by the CEO.

Speaker 2: 11:10

That's how small they are so I was just saying this could have played out a little differently if you had someone just on our side a competent HR person who knew well actually I'm going to skip on my list here because, talking about competent HR people, our friend Dan from atraw. He has first, if you don't subscribe to him on tiktok, you have to. He's fantastic, drop dead, hilarious and he's so I don't know, he, he, he. Anyways, he subscribed to him on TikTok. I don't have TikTok, but I still watch him on Instagram every once in a while and I catch up on, I get shared his stuff all the time Anyways.

Speaker 2: 11:54

So this is sort of a little back and forth between day and from HR. Day and space is his name. And, um, anyways, this writer her name is Erin Mcgolf. She wrote an article titled the number one job interview phrase that will set you apart from everyone else's career experts. It's the most powerful and it's a short article on MSNBC and the phrase is the one thing that excites me about this role is blank and she says it makes you sound more confident, it's positive and shows your capability, it demonstrates your research and preparation. And so Dan, who, who's good at online busting bad career advice is, he said that that's a little ableist and we should caution people not to use or judge that language as it is not inclusive to neurodiverse people who may not understand or be able to articulate excitement. Number two, if you're interviewing, the hiring manager knows that you're interested. Saying it doesn't really make a difference. And three, it does not offer any other benefits outlined here and research. I'll just hit each of those are my thing. It doesn't make you sound more comfortable. No, I don't like when someone is in an interview.

Speaker 2: 13:08

I spent many years recruiting. I still do a little bit. I'm a little bit involved now, but when I feel they're giving me a can dancer and when you're telling them to here's a can dancer for you, uh, uh, to do it, it it recruiters, we hear that stuff all the time and it gets old very quickly. So, whatever the newest tick tock trend and interviewing, I'm sure recruiters are hearing a lot of it. But in terms of research, I absolutely hate when, in the course of a interview, a prospective employee is trying to think that they know more about the company now than you do. Is they read you on social media and they did their, they tried to do their homework and and things like that. I I at the job I'm at now, I interviewed and I I applied. Whatever day it was, I interviewed like two days later and I didn't do a ton of homework, but I've read their website and I cut to the office early. I'm in their parking lot looking at their website, looking at our social media and I just happened to mention something oh yeah, we're not in our that industry anymore, but she knew it was on her on the webpage and things like that. So that, yeah, it's not good with that. My name was, I replied to Dan's post and then here was my response.

Speaker 2: 14:24

When any article starts with the number one blank or I'm an HR expert blank, that tells me that's clickbait and there's no value in the article other than being fodder for ridicule and scorn. Secondly, the second line of her bio tells me the writer isn't going to add any value because their measure of value is how many followers they have, not the quality of her content. And her literal headline on her LinkedIn profile is founder of advice with it, with Aaron 4.5 million viewers on followers on social media, etc. Career and life-advanced documentary filmmaker. So if your number one thing is how many followers you have, it's that's telling me. All I need to know is that's how you're basing your, your value to the world, based on how many followers you have I'm I'm proud to say I'm down to under 200 on my personal all of them trimming people left right up and down, and I hope to get down to under 100 sometime soon, but anyways.

Speaker 3: 15:22

It's a privilege to be your follower.

Speaker 2: 15:25

Yes, dan goes on. He says I have nothing against Aaron Mcgolf. She's blocked me on every app. She's even proactively blocked me on one of his other accounts that I favored one of her most harmful videos. She's also blocked every other recruiter, hiring manager and HR person who has called her out on her bad advice, since she is unable to face or acknowledge that she has made a tremendous amount of success in a subject she has no experience in. And he goes on and on about that. And then a CNBC actually hired her for this and he tagged CNBC. You're promoting a scam artist like her LinkedIn profile. I don't think she's ever had a full-time job, nevermind one in three roles of a company that actually makes hiring decisions a hiring manager, hr, a recruiter. All of her work is contract intern or nanny. So I was like damn.

Speaker 3: 16:14

Oh my God, Dan from HR is doing the Lord's work.

Speaker 2: 16:16

Yes, he is, yeah, so that really got to me. It's just once again, hr gets a bad rap and it's people like this who give it a bad rap. Oh yeah, we'll have a pizza party and we'll do this and everybody will be happy and I only fly for that easy, for that.

Speaker 3: 16:36

Yeah, it's funny too, because that advice of like, tell people what you're excited about, that's advice my mom would give me if I was going on a job. That's not groundbreaking, that's not good, it's not groundbreaking, it's nothing.

Speaker 2: 16:53

Here. I'm going to actually read out loud and this person will forgive me, I'm sure A conversation we had who's going on to interview they're over their job and I'm not going to name the person it goes. Any advice? I have an interview this afternoon and I tagged this article as I just read it and sent it to him. I said here's a complete BS article that won't help. I said otherwise just be yourself, no profanity or flatulence and everything will be good. And I said good luck. So if you don't mind, I'll continue on one more, because I think, if you think about I think last week in the episode I talked about it had you actually read the emails part of our intro. Well, this this I'm thinking this whole episode is going to be the views of these HR experts is not the opinions of their past, present or future employers. Well, another person who's been on the podcast, david Miklis. He wrote on LinkedIn on January 17th. This was so funny.

Speaker 2: 17:55

Be careful when delisting to podcasts by hashtag HR professionals. I recently heard a podcast by an HR professional who stated the consequences of filing violating the FLSA were basically only fines and fees. This is incorrect. In fact, most significantly, significant liability does not come from civil monetary penalties, but rather from unpaid wages and liquidated damages. Both things get. Both of these things go back to the employee, not the government. I'm all for human resources understanding employment law, but when it comes to educating other HR professionals in HR laws, it's a best practice to lead it to the employment lawyers. Don't get me wrong there's some amazing HR professionals out there providing excellent content on a variety of topics, and I encourage them to continue to do so. And it's sort of funny as he goes on in one of the commenters with what HR podcasts you listen to, and he mentioned jaded HR. So thank you, david, that's awesome. Yeah, I among others, but that's the exact thing. If you're taking anything that I, cc or feathers say as the word of the HR Lord, you've got problems.

Speaker 1: 19:04

Good luck.

Speaker 2: 19:06

You are probably going to end up fired and sued if you do what we say. This isn't that type of podcast and I hope that comes through loud and clear. But I was going to make some sort of snot comment. It wasn't jaded HR.

Speaker 3: 19:21

Funny. I was laughing like speaking of HR experts and I don't think this person. I'm going to go out on a limb and say this person was not working in HR, but she knew everything there was to know about HR.

Speaker 3: 19:32

Yeah, and I don't know what it was. It was like a video or something on Instagram and people were like commenting back and forth. I had to do with maternity leave in the US. And this woman was like, well, you know, that's against the law. The US is mandated to give paid maternity leave. And I was like like, stop back up, excuse me. So then I questioned it and she's like well, every job I did. And then I was like like I went back and forth with her like once or twice and I'm like, oh, I understand what's happening. Now you don't know what you're talking about.

Speaker 3: 20:05

But you think, you do, I'm going to go do something else with my life. We're good. But yeah, it was like this whole back and forth of like it's a mandate, they have to provide it and I'm like, no, no, they don't, we don't have to do anything.

Speaker 2: 20:18

See, I really have to hold myself back when I was on social media. But we're about engaging those people Because I can. I can be like a dog with a bone, you know I I am part of baseball for 15 years and one of the sayings they say is arguing with the umpires like mud wrestling with a pig. It's cool and all, until you realize pig likes it. So I could get myself in serious trouble and damage by arguing with people with these stupid things and employees. Well, my last company say to our department did this, I don't care what they did, they did it wrong it was incorrect.

Speaker 2: 20:50

Yeah, and or my, my, my wife's company HR person says this well, they said it wrong, yeah, anyways. Well, while we're still kicking around social media, you got another tiki toki story.

Speaker 3: 21:06

So this girl her name's Brittany Peach and she was getting terminated, like it was like a mass layoff situation and I guess she knew it was coming because it was one of those situations where everyone was getting like these random 15 minute interviews like on their calendar, meetings on their calendar, and then she would hear from the grapevine of the people before her that they were getting termed, they're so this, this woman came guns blazing and I do have to say this was a masterclass on how not to fire somebody, because I mean, it was every single thing. Now, I've never had to fire anybody, luckily, like I've never had to terminate, I've never had to be part of one of those conversations. But as someone who's done learning and development, this goes against everything that I've taught. So, and I think the one thing was, you know, it wasn't even her manager on the call and it wasn't even her HRBP on the call. It was two people who she had never met before in the company coming in to have this conversation. Like, hey, just to let you know, we were looking through the calibrations. We realized that you're kind of the bottom tier of performance amongst, so we're just letting all these people in this little area go, because you know you're all bottom performers.

Speaker 3: 22:22

And she kind of came with receipts. She was like who are you? I never met you. Where's my manager? My manager has never given me negative feedback. Again, number one rule is like the performance should never be a surprise. And it was just like this whole thing of like. And finally she was like Can you tell me why? Me and this is why I remembered her name, because she was like Can you tell me why Brittany Peach is getting fired? And they're like oh, we can't get into the like, we can't get into the details. And it was like what, what is happening? So the whole call deteriorated. It was very cringey to watch, not because of her, more so because of the two professionals that were on the other line. Again, masterclass on what not to do when you're terminating somebody.

Speaker 2: 23:05

Yeah, I did not watch the video myself. Once again, I have to rely on Susan Lucas to read her articles every single day, but on her take on it so, and they tried to play it off as a layoff or a performance. And then they say it's a layoff. And then they went online. Sam Flare went online. Oh, we're not doing any layoffs, and the whole thing just I don't know got it's weird in so many different ways. If you're doing a layoff, just do a layoff. And Suzanne Lucas said this only on FGO on the reasons why Make it short and sweet.

Speaker 2: 23:39

Hey, the company is doing a reduction for us. You were selected for that, or today is your last day, or whatever. You want to say three lines or less and that's all you have to do. But if you're trying to tie it to performance a lot, okay, get my soapbox lying and never get to anywhere. It's your bottom performer. Well, how? Show me how I'm a bottom performer? What stats, what data? And they don't. They didn't do their homework. If you're gonna lie, at least come up with something.

Speaker 3: 24:10

Yeah, I mean like if she called it, she kind of called it out because I think she could see right through it and she said so I like not verbatim, but she basically said, like I kind of see right through this. What you're saying is you've hired too many people and now you can't afford us.

Speaker 1: 24:26

So now you're letting us go, and it was like girl, like she.

Speaker 3: 24:30

Yeah, that's probably what was happening, because if we're taking what she's saying as truth and her manager has given her nothing but positive performance and like she's never had a write up, she's never had like a pip, she's never had any kind of that construction feedback, constructive feedback, then this is not. This is not a termination of performance.

Speaker 2: 24:53

Exactly, and I don't know what state this took place in, but nowadays so many states are I mean even making it for performance. Unless you do something ungodly, you're still going to get unemployment. So it's not even like it's gonna. It's gonna do anything, just so, just call it what it is to lay off, sorry, you know. Better luck next time, or whatever you want to say, but just, I don't know the lying and the continual. I'm assuming you saw the video.

Speaker 3: 25:22

Yes.

Speaker 2: 25:23

How did she record this video of her getting terminated Was like were she physically live in the office with them, or is it done online or no, she was online.

Speaker 3: 25:34

She looked like she was a remote worker and she had her phone like propped up, so it was like it was on her, but like obviously you couldn't see who was on the screen. So, Okay, you just saw her.

Speaker 2: 25:45

Interesting, interesting, and Suzanne Lucas did mention always assume you're being recorded and, yep, you are. In this case you were being recorded, it's just wow. And Soundflare, I want to say we've discussed some other HR issues with them in the past. One day, I'm gonna actually have to create a little database of you know our companies besides Chipotle we talk about on regularly, so I can. Oh yeah, we talked about Soundflare once upon a time, so that's yeah, like I said, masterclass in class and what not to do.

Speaker 2: 26:18

Real quick, I have two more things I think we can cover today, but I talked about going back into the archives of JDDHR. Well, going way back to season one, episode five, from 2020, april of 2020. The episode was infinitesimal PTO numbers for a scary HR timeline. So I talked about an employee who was so concerned about the difference in PTO between the timekeeping system and the payroll system, which were two different systems. The timekeeping system went to four decimal places and, for whatever stupid reason, in the payroll system, only went to two, and so over the course of his entire tenure there, he'd been shorted about 10 minutes of PTO, about 10 minutes.

Speaker 2: 27:08

And no, I talked to the president about that. He said, well, he could just take that 10 minutes anytime he pleases. Well, he's back and so, okay, there was a mistake made on HR's part and I owned that, even though I didn't do it, but I owned it and set up it was his 401k for 2024. He always contributes the max and it went up a whopping $500 this year for the year that you can contribute, or 401k. So he comes in. He's like he's, like you know, very upset. So I had a time to calm him down and anything.

Speaker 2: 27:43

And once I found out what the problem was, I looked and I was like, oh, wow, this didn't go through. So I said we'll fix it. How do you, would you like to fix it? We can do one time checkout. We can divvy up the next difference over the remaining amount you contribute over to the next 25 pay periods. Now let me tell you $500 here, 26 pay periods. It's less than $20 a total and I understand it being frustrating, but I think it's a good idea. I understand it being frustrating, but it's not anything to get upset about $20. And he's not paid poorly by any stretch of the imagination, so that $20 was not it, but just the fact that you would get okay.

Speaker 2: 28:21

Mistakes happen and I understand that payroll is a super sensitive. The most personal thing HR ever touches on employees lives is their payroll. But I'm not going to build my hill on $20 of difference. I mean, I was willing to just throw $20 out of myself to get them out of my office after 10 minutes. So this was not a short conversation and I was like, okay, we'll fix it, we can fix it, this is fixable, we can do this, but anyways, that was part of my week last week, and so my final story of the day comes from James Hudson on LinkedIn, and he too is trashing some of these HR experts on LinkedIn. So he writes look, I think it's wonderful you got hired into a fang company, which I had to. Google means Facebook, amazon, gosh, what's the other a? I forget Netflix and Google one of those high tech companies. They was excited. It's great you got hired to a fang company despite having poor grades, or that you're really good at video editing, social media and you know how to rock a blazer and a corporate haircut, and these are great stories and fun gimmicks. It doesn't mean you're in a position to speak from a place of authority on how hiring actually works. If you want to learn how to make Hollandaise sauce properly, would you rather learn from a chef that makes it every day or from someone who's been to a restaurant a couple of times and just really enjoys talking about Hollandaise sauce on the internet?

Speaker 2: 29:50

All these influencers and quotes are just looking to grow their own brands by producing totally erroneous clickbait. At worst, they're hoping to sell to desperate people, often at astronomical prices, for genuine, helpful, accurate advice, follow any of these accounts, and Dan from HR was that's how I found it. He was linked to that article. It's I think 2024 is shaping up to be the year of the expert in quotes who doesn't know what the hell they're doing. So I can't say enough if you're going to get some HR advice online, do your homework. Know somebody, ask somebody who knows what they're talking about. Don't just say, oh, this person's got a million followers on LinkedIn or Facebook, instagram, whatever it is. They have to know. And no, it's quite often the exact opposite.

Speaker 3: 30:44

They just they don't know.

Speaker 2: 30:46

They don't know and for the most part. So I'm going to dub 2024 the year of the fake expert. Let's see if they can prove me wrong. And that's my expert analysis for this. Anyways, that is all, I'll go ahead.

Speaker 3: 31:01

I was going to say I think you're right, but I also hope you're wrong.

Speaker 2: 31:04

It'll be fun if I'm right.

Speaker 3: 31:06

It would be. It would be. There's so many out there.

Speaker 2: 31:10

Plenty of fodder.

Speaker 3: 31:12

Like yeah, net, net. Linkedin has become such a cesspool of it is just self self loving experts.

Speaker 2: 31:21

And oh, I one of these comments to. I think I replied to James Hudson's comments and, hey, I would love to. He was going to talk about making a list of people you should be following for real career advice and I said why don't we make a list of these shysters and put them out there? And he says, oh, you know he's better than that. And of course he is. I'm not. I would call these people others. One person I don't know how. You know, I spend my free time at work on LinkedIn. I don't know how she people share her stuff and it's not that she's a phony HR person, it's just all of her advice is sunshine and roses and little kitten posters and things like that. Okay, that's great, but there's no content there. There's no, you know, and she posts like ridiculous. And so many people share her stuff but like I don't want to see this anymore. It's like it's everywhere. But yeah, it's, it's, it's a little crazy online.

Speaker 3: 32:18

Yeah, I will say it's not just online. There's in, like my, my local market, where I am, there is a. There's an individual who I used to work with in a corporate setting who went off and they kind of did their own thing to become a consultant.

Speaker 2: 32:34

Okay.

Speaker 3: 32:34

Which I have mixed feelings about. I have mixed opinions about, very strong mixed opinions about, but it was like eight years since we've worked together I'm more than that. It was like eight, nine years and I saw him do his spiel at a big conference locally and he was doing the same stuff he was doing eight years ago.

Speaker 1: 32:54

Like he and.

Speaker 3: 32:54

I worked together and like people were like doting him, as this you know really talented expert guru, yada, yada, yada, and I was just like, and I was sitting in the front row, but at that point I was just, I was being an ass, just kind of leaned back.

Speaker 3: 33:10

I leaned back in my chair, across my arms, and just stared at him and just started like I had this grin on my face cause I knew exactly what he was doing. I think I shook him a little bit cause he like did screw up the activity and I was like there you go. But I mean like, come on, it's like you're selling the same stuff you've sold for nine years or whatever. I'm like this is, this is insane.

Speaker 2: 33:33

Well, that's part of the HR speaker circuit. It's just so bad with people that are repeating the same thing and once you've seen John Doe once, at the whatever seminar you go to, you know two years later you see him at another seminar, different brand, everything same story and it's like okay, I'm over this already. And the speaker circuit for HR overall is pure awful and that's why I don't go to conferences. My boss even asked me last year do you want to go to any national conference? I'm like no, I don't. You can save your money, I can spend your money elsewhere, and things like that. That's not, I'm not going to get anything out of it.

Speaker 3: 34:13

So I will say I did like I did go to SHRM. I know there's like a love hate relationship with SHRM. I did go to the SHRM conference a few years ago in Vegas and that was that was a good time. I mean I just I went alone cause no one else at work was available and I ended up like meeting other people and it was a party Like I could. I mean, let me just tell for those who don't know HR, people are unhinged when there's like a bunch of them and alcohol, it's just like they are the. They are the biggest partiers that you will ever find and I had a blast.

Speaker 3: 34:52

I will go again. Let's go.

Speaker 2: 34:55

You're going to Chicago this year now.

Speaker 3: 35:00

Unfortunately, I think I'm gonna have a newborn at some point, so I can't.

Speaker 2: 35:04

Yeah, I, if there was one that was convenient. I know they only hold it in these mega cities and none of them are. I think one year is in DC, but that that's like five hours away from me. But I'm not gonna go to. If it's not convenient, I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna waste my time, but just to go to shirm the national conference. I know we're over time and whatever, but who cares the go to the national conference it's like five thousand dollars for a person between the admission, the airfare hotels, the hotels jack up their prices and things like that or whatever they're, and it's just like I have a lot of other things I can do with five thousand dollars, yeah, and be missing out on work. So I get home back from work, I have to do two weeks of work in one week, so now, no, thank you on that.

Speaker 3: 35:55

Yeah maybe Maybe on another, maybe on another episode. I will go into my my shirm. Was it my shirm wildings?

Speaker 2: 36:04

that happened back a few years ago, because but what happened to biggest does not stay in Vegas no, it does not.

Speaker 3: 36:11

And it was fantastic. I felt like I was living some like crazy movie. I'm like this is a shirm conference. I'm in like let's just do it.

Speaker 2: 36:19

It was at the biggest one I've read. Oh gosh, there was some podcast HR podcaster. The company was promoting CBD products and they had Samplings on the rooftop of some hotel and was like all these HR people just stoned out of their minds. I forget. I heard about it on some podcast once upon a time, I don't remember which one. I'd love to give credit to the people but are like yeah, that's a great thing to do you want to know.

Speaker 2: 36:45

Yeah, alrighty. Well, that's gonna wrap us up for today. We come back in two weeks and hopefully there'll be the three amigos again and see what we can make happen then. In the meantime, our best practice will be You're not an expert, even if you think you are. Give it up, try something else. But as always, I'm Warren. I'm CC and we're here helping you survive HR one. What the fuck moment at a time.